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Add svdot[_n_f16_mf8]_fpm and svdot[_n_f32_mf8]_fpm #369

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momchil-velikov
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Accidentally omitted.


name: Pull request
about: Technical issues, document format problems, bugs in scripts or feature proposal.


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@andrewcarlotti
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I don't think we want these - the other svdot intrinsics don't have an _n variant either, and I don't think it makes sense to add one since the indexed segment for these instructions consists of either two or four elements, unlike the single indexed element used in MLA instructions.

@momchil-velikov
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I don't think we want these - the other svdot intrinsics don't have an _n variant either, and I don't think it makes sense to add one since the indexed segment for these instructions consists of either two or four elements, unlike the single indexed element used in MLA instructions.

I don't see the relevance of the indexed forms of the instructions.
There are seven other *dot_n intrinsics and also other *_n intrinsics.

@rsandifo-arm
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LGTM, but could you also change:

#### UDOT, SDOT, FDOT (vectors)

Multi-vector dot-product (2-way)

``` c
  // Variants are also available for _s32_s16 and _u32_u16
  svfloat32_t svdot[_f32_f16](svfloat32_t zda, svfloat16_t zn,
                              svfloat16_t zm);
  ```

while you're there?

@momchil-velikov
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LGTM, but could you also change:

#### UDOT, SDOT, FDOT (vectors)

Multi-vector dot-product (2-way)

``` c
  // Variants are also available for _s32_s16 and _u32_u16
  svfloat32_t svdot[_f32_f16](svfloat32_t zda, svfloat16_t zn,
                              svfloat16_t zm);

while you're there?

What needs to change?

@andrewcarlotti
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Ah - so https://developer.arm.com/architectures/instruction-sets/intrinsics/ says that there are dot_n intrinsics for SVE but not for Neon, but they aren't listed in acle.md. I just checked that they are also defined in GCC.

I think Richard is asking you to add the existing indexed versions to the list of SVE intrinsics in acle.md.

Given that we actually do have existing dot_n intrinsics for SVE, I'm fine with adding these ones as well. But I still might have preferred to have none of them.
For comparison, the main justification (in my opinion) for including mla_n intrinsics is that they correspond to a single architecture instruction (the indexed for of the instruction with index 0). This justification doesn't apply to the dot_n intrinsics, where we still have to duplicate the scalar input into a vector.

@rsandifo-arm
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Given that we actually do have existing dot_n intrinsics for SVE, I'm fine with adding these ones as well. But I still might have preferred to have none of them.
For comparison, the main justification (in my opinion) for including mla_n intrinsics is that they correspond to a single architecture instruction (the indexed for of the instruction with index 0). This justification doesn't apply to the dot_n intrinsics, where we still have to duplicate the scalar input into a vector.

That wasn't the reason for adding the extra _n intrinsics to SVE. Instead it was that:

  • SVE has (relatively) more immediate forms than Advanced SIMD, and we wanted those immediate forms to be available without an explicit dup.
  • The immediates are somewhat irregular (e.g. 0 or 1 for fmax, 0.5 or 2 for fmul, 0.5 or 1 for fadd), so we wanted to hide the exact ranges from the user. We therefore allowed the scalar arguments to be any immediate, not just in-range immediates, with the compiler synthesising a constant vector where necessary.
  • That in turn meant that it was more natural not to require an immediate at all, but instead allow any scalar.
  • Then it seemed natural to provide these immediate-like scalars in all contexts where an immediate would make conceptual sense. That gives a more regular interface, and avoids users having to remember which instructions have immediate forms and which don't.

@andrewcarlotti
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That wasn't the reason for adding the extra _n intrinsics to SVE. Instead it was that:

  • SVE has (relatively) more immediate forms than Advanced SIMD, and we wanted those immediate forms to be available without an explicit dup.
  • The immediates are somewhat irregular (e.g. 0 or 1 for fmax, 0.5 or 2 for fmul, 0.5 or 1 for fadd), so we wanted to hide the exact ranges from the user. We therefore allowed the scalar arguments to be any immediate, not just in-range immediates, with the compiler synthesising a constant vector where necessary.
  • That in turn meant that it was more natural not to require an immediate at all, but instead allow any scalar.
  • Then it seemed natural to provide these immediate-like scalars in all contexts where an immediate would make conceptual sense. That gives a more regular interface, and avoids users having to remember which instructions have immediate forms and which don't.

Thanks for the context - it's interesting that the same conclusions arise from considering instructions with immediates instead of instructions with index zero.

@CarolineConcatto
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CarolineConcatto commented Jan 6, 2025

Hey Momchil,
I believe you forgot to address Richard's comment:
LGTM, but could you also change:

UDOT, SDOT, FDOT (vectors)

Multi-vector dot-product (2-way)

  // Variants are also available for _s32_s16 and _u32_u16
  svfloat32_t svdot[_f32_f16](svfloat32_t zda, svfloat16_t zn,
                              svfloat16_t zm);

while you're there?
What needs to change?

So I believe he wants to add also a scalar version for this dot, like:

  // Variants are also available for _s32_s16 and _u32_u16
  svfloat32_t svdot[_f32_f16](svfloat32_t zda, svfloat16_t zn,
                              svfloat16_t zm);
+svfloat32_t svdot[n_f32_f16](svfloat32_t zda, svfloat16_t zn,
                               float16_t zm);

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4 participants